Jump to content

IOM Class Association


Recommended Posts

I don't mind going first on the subject.

Having sailed in most of the ranking races up and down the country since the class started in the 80's it is obvious to me that it now needs to be run as a stand alone class with the owners running the class and take the burden away from the MYA.

Over the last 4 years the MYA have taken me to lakes with weed, leaves, buoys that float away, multiple races in same district in the same calender year etc etc. The discussion on the bank is always the same, rubbish venue, rubbish race team etc.

Instead of us all sitting round, which we do a lot of, lets take the burden away from the MYA and lets start organising the calender ourselves at lakes that suit our needs at times that are appropiate for that certain venue.

We would not need a large committee to run the class, i would say just 2 or 3 would do the job.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Graham & all,

I first floated the idea of "stand alone class associations" running the classes at the May Council meeting & I stand by my suggestion. But, be careful what you wish for!! As we may end up with 2 all powerful classes (IOM & M) and several limping along.

Not a problem if you sail one of the good ones, buy what about the rest?

Just a thought ?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Site Admin
Hi Graham & all,

I first floated the idea of "stand alone class associations" running the classes at the May Council meeting & I stand by my suggestion. But, be careful what you wish for!! As we may end up with 2 all powerful classes (IOM & M) and several limping along.

Not a problem if you sail one of the good ones, buy what about the rest?

Just a thought ?

 

To me that means no one wants the other classes (would be a shame but that's how survival of the fittest works). If each class ran itself then it would be up to that class to maintain / grow its popularity. I guess the only issue would be if one of the bigger classes started using its clout to supress a smaller class that is starting to compete and grow ?.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Following the May Council meeting and prior to my resignation as the Promotion and Development Officer, I put forward a structure which supported Derek's idea of "stand alone class associations". I have attached a copy of the proposal, which identifies a structure that streamlines MYA Council and at the same time defines Council and Class Association sub-committee responsibilities.

This structure would enable Council to concentrate their efforts on managing and developing the Association in a cost effective manner, whilst at the same time, allowing the classes to develop, but still part of the MYA - as previously stated, whether a class developed or failed would be the responsibility of the owners and not Council.

MYA Council StructureV2.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi Graham & all,

I first floated the idea of "stand alone class associations" running the classes at the May Council meeting & I stand by my suggestion. But, be careful what you wish for!! As we may end up with 2 all powerful classes (IOM & M) and several limping along.

Not a problem if you sail one of the good ones, buy what about the rest?

Just a thought ?

 

Derek I'm saddened to read that you think a RM or IOM NCA would be interested in suppressing the national classes, that clearly would not be the case.

Surely its in everyones interest to keep this pathway open?

John, I think standalone class associations clearly means separate to the MYA, logic would suggest that the MYA would be responsible for promoting the sport and some technical areas for non international classes, so basically the radio sailing or free sailing version of the RYA.

As Graham mentioned some of the ranking races over the last couple of years have been criticised by the skippers competing for various reasons. If we have active skippers willing to take the burden from the MYA whats the issue? By thinking progressively and a willingness to change, standalone class associations might be able to give the sport and class fresh impetus to move forward.

Or we can carry on as is, Is there really a decision to be made?

My two pennies worth, surely we have more skippers out there with an opinion?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ian, if you look at the structure I put forward, it would be the responsibility of the Competitions Secretary to coordinate the MYA National and Ranking evens in conjunction with the Class Captains and District Racing Secretaries. Other events would then be coordinated by the Class Captains and District Racing Secretaries!

I think we have to recognise that with the number of classes around these days, assuming they all survive, there are going to be enevitable clashes of events, whichever system is implemented.

Link to post
Share on other sites

John, the structure of the MYA is a bit off topic and i'd suggest it is best discussed in its own thread, why don't you start one in general discussion?

Can we get back to Darin's original post

GBR IOM Class Association

Inside the MYA or a stand alone organisation.

Discuss......../quote]

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Site Admin
Brad, I welcome your input and fully support everything you have said. I only wish members of council would listen to the membership instead of thinking they know best!

 

John before I start this is not aimed at you or any one specifically but is meant as a general comment.

This topic was started by a member of council so at a guess at least one of them is prepared to listen.

No wonder no one wants to be on council when all they get is moans and complaints (far easier than actually trying to do something).

I have seen this over the years in all sorts of organisations I have been a member of and do wonder sometimes how some of them ever keep going. Simple answer is if you think things can be run better then take an active role (But don't be surprised if you are then the target of complaints instead) otherwise let those who are willing do what they feel is right to the best of their ability (After all they are all volunteers).

So please all put forward constructive suggestions and ways things can be change but have the grace to accept that council can not do everything and may not always agree with your ideas.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Garry, having been a member of council for some five years or so I have experienced the comments that come from the membership. I have also had to sit and listen to certain members of council pontificate about what happened years ago. Like Keith Coxon I tried to move the MYA forward with constructive comments and developments only to be thwarted many times. If the MYA is to move forward and develop it needs to listen to the membership by going through the questionnaire responses. Before resigning earlier this year, I did put forward a structure that would make council more streamlined and productive, so please do not accuse me of not making constructive suggestions, as I have done this throughout my time on council both as a District Councillor and the Development Officer.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Site Admin
Garry, having been a member of council for some five years or so I have experienced the comments that come from the membership. I have also had to sit and listen to certain members of council pontificate about what happened years ago. Like Keith Coxon I tried to move the MYA forward with constructive comments and developments only to be thwarted many times. If the MYA is to move forward and develop it needs to listen to the membership by going through the questionnaire responses. Before resigning earlier this year, I did put forward a structure that would make council more streamlined and productive, so please do not accuse me of not making constructive suggestions, as I have done this throughout my time on council both as a District Councillor and the Development Officer.

 

John as I already said this was not mean as a criticism of any individual or meant as a comment on your actions. Just a general comment that it is far easier to sit back and take swipes than to actively take part in making changes. I applaud anyone who has had the nerve to be on the council of any voluntary organisation whether their plans and ideas came to be enacted or not. I know from experience that it is a thankless task and that you can never please everyone and also sometimes you might as well bang your head against a brick wall.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The recent comments on the subject of Class Associations are very interesting but surely the point is being missed we cannot it seems get people to sit on one organisation, the MYA council, and the answer is not to get a load more organisations and thus have more unfilled seats on them.

Mike Ewart

Link to post
Share on other sites
The recent comments on the subject of Class Associations are very interesting but surely the point is being missed we cannot it seems get people to sit on one organisation, the MYA council, and the answer is not to get a load more organisations and thus have more unfilled seats on them.

 

Hi Mike,

Would the class groups not decide their own structure?

The IOM would need a larger organisation as it is an international class and has a large following but the classes with lower numbers may only need a couple of people to organise it. The MYA can still sit in the background for advice if the class wants help but only acting if requested.

The Radio A is a great example, the PRACC series when I started was a great series sailed by the class enthusiasts, nothing to do with the MYA but took into account what the skippers liked and sought their views in an informal way by Dave and Linda Munro. It had no formal structure but the series kept the class alive and created pockets of interest, just as you and Peter are doing with the 6's.

The MYA and international classes need a defined structure as that is the route they have taken but the other classes just need to have the "bases covered" so that their skippers can enjoy sailing them.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Brad, agree with what you say, but not sure the large classes are the "cash cows" for the MYA you suggest, but introducing a class levy at events to cover the costs of class admin would be a good idea.

The MYA levy was dropped but this could be brought back as a class levy on rankings and nationals for the larger classes and maybe in travellerbseries for smaller classes, again decided by the class.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a stong advocate of Class Associations. Only with that structure will classes that have enthusiasm from within prosper and grow.. it should be recognised that some of the 'old' national classes and maybe international classes may struggle to find support. As such the classes will find their own level of activity and support. It should also be recognised that the scene is changing with the arrival of the New Classes. Since leaving the MYA organisation I have volunteered to work with John Tushingham to look to create a strong Class Association for the 65 and 95. I do recognise that as restricted classes things are somewhat simple however ...We have in a couple of months put together a Class committee with John as President (World) great title! We have a Chairman/Secretary, Racing Officer, Membership Officer and Registrar and a Publicity Officer/Webmaster. This enthusiastic Gang of Four have created DF Racing UK CA representing both boats. We have a draft constitution, Class SSI's a Traveller series for 2017 for both boats (work almost complete) along with Nationals for both boats. All done in a couple of months. Our registration data shows the strength of both boats in terms of ownership and number of MYA Clubs sailing fleets regularly. We are so passionate we are taking a Class Association stand at the 2017 Dinghy Show. Maybe time to stop talking and get on and make things happen. BTW Brad''s comments show how well he understands hoŵ things should work

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites

Keith's post is the exact reason why the classes have to be give freedom to control their own destiny.

The DF group have only been around for a short period and have created an association, got publicity and created racing events, Ok they have had a massive "leg up" in being able to copy from other classes and elements of the MYA structure, but they have done this whilst the MYA Council has been occupied debating with IRSA,trying to find a chairman, lost publicity, etc etc.

Its no wonder their classes are showing growth when the IOM, M etc are trying to fight their way to the front of the MYA "to do" list.

You would think that being a class within the MYA structure would be an advantage, but at this current time its a handicap to those who wish to use their enthusiasm to build these classes and we must change this.

Others mention about "beware of what you wish" and i agree that there needs to be some degree of accountability and a base framework to ensure the sport and classes are represented fairly, but hey, we can make a boat miss another by mm's, turn on a sixpence and still shout starboard whilst being 50m away from the thing, surely we can figure out how to set up class groups that build our sport!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Morning Graham

To answer your question the DF Racing UK CA has been developed to support the two Dragon boats and is not focussed on the RG65. Our work however has been done with the full involvement of Mark Dicks as CC RG65 and his colleagues. The RG65 Class is organising its own Traveller Series (which DF65 boats can enter if they wish) The DF Racing registrar is also managing the RG65 registration but this gives the opportunity to maintain separate data for the boats. It is honestly not difficult, as always it just needs a few people ŵith enthusiasm. I hope this helps

Cheers

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Brad

I did recognise that the DF classes do not have a baggage of history that other classes do have and it is therefore easier. In simple terms I was trying to demonstrate that where there is a will there is a way. If I came across as gleaming? or seeming to be a smart a**e then I apologise

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites

WEll I have ploughed through all this and have a few points to make.

With the growth and strength of the IOM, so long as you can maintain a national comittee which the makes contact with the International one, you have what is known as a 'self administered' class which runs its own affairs but under the MYA umbrella, to maintain contact with other classes and make use of MYA facilities, such as Technical. The only pitfall to being self administered is that the inevitable paranoia sets in over the rules whenever anything new comes along and makes the hot shots feel threatened. This leads to all sorts of exotic rule drafting and strange unenforceable rules being passed. The other drawback is that the majority of owners dont want to get involved in tedious things like rule minutia so the top 5% tend to drive the development in the class and sometimes an uninvolved third party to run things by and assess if it is really necessary or even achievable is worth it's weight in gold. Enter the MYA.

When the IOM came into being it hit the three other classes hard and they have struggled at various times to keep going but they also need to be self administered so that they can control what rule changes are desirable and which not. If they are going to thrive again, their rules must be pitched to encourage that and a practical approach is needed.

The new classes that are coming along are a healthy sign. They may well be 'Tupperware' boats or lightly converted boats like the ThunderTiger et al but so what? Many years ago I was at the London Boat Show - the year that the Mirror dinghy was launched and while I was looking I found myself standing beside Jack Knights, a well known yachting journalist. I asked him what he thought about the boat and after a long pause he said 'It will get a lot of people sailing and then they will go out and buy a boat.' Different times and different classes but as true now as then. When I hear about people not getting enough sailing because the 'new' classes are using the water I think that the MYA hasnt made a bad fist of things since the mid nineties. Gosport then had about 30-odd members of which about 5 were actively sailing radio and half a dozen or so in vanes. Now both the lakes are in use for a variety of classes most of the week. I would call that win,win.

So basically, go for self administration and make the class(es) flourish and then let MYA continue to support the sport and the sailors for the optimum result.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Val, some relevant points from your experience.

The MYA have obviously given the IOM class the opportunity to break free from the shackles and to move the class in the direction the owners wish it to move forward.

Mike Ewart made a fair point, how do we fill the roles of any NCA when we cannot fill the roles on the MYA council? I for one have absolutely no wish to sit on the MYA council but would be willing to be part of an IOM NCA and i am sure others feel the same passion for there class ,as Keith has pointed out about the DF65 and 95, they had no problem finding 4 skippers to make up there NCA.

To get things moving and off the ground i have a small group of dedicated and able skippers from the class, who i believe will do a good job and cover most bases, myself, Gavin Watson, Colin Goodman and Victoria Gibson.

Graham Elliott

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an extremely fundamental and thought provoking debate which should be the basis for the MYA AGM agenda. Unfortunately most will be asleep by the time an opportunity to raise this and have a discussion under AOB by which time people will be restless for the exit.

Perhaps one of the first things that needs to change is the AGM agenda itself which has contained the same old, same old items in the same order for as long as I can remember. The agenda is probably prescribed by the Constitution so that needs to change too. This will not wait another year, it's too important. Never mind procedure and protocol - lets curtail the routine stuff and make room for a proper debate at this AGM.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi All

Great post here for all to take on board, i have for a long time have supported the establishment of class association its the fundlemental move forward for growth in the UK for owners to be in total control of their class. I have spoken to Gavin over many months for a formation of a group of didicated individuals that can move this forward, the marblehead class will follow shortly after. The most important thought is this do we want class association and therefore the owners then take control?

I for one will encourage that route 100%. Its the logical path forward for sucess of our sport of radio sailing. I disagree with Mikes comment re filling roles on MYA council as the forward path re class associations will mean the MYA consentrate on a reduced agenda and as such require fewer members on council due to reduced workload that will be carried out at class level.

i truly believe the MYA is in a transitional point in its formation, outlook and management in the foreseable future which will require a new and updated constituion as a consequence.

Graham

Glad you and Victoria are on board with the IOM its the only way forward

Terry Rensch

Chair MYA

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...